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Forum » AT-43 Discussions » AT-43 - Rules, inHouse Rules & FAQs » AT-43 Ability Query (Karman - Curtain of Flames!)
AT-43 Ability Query
BanksiDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 9:19 PM | Message # 41
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OK,

Since we have agreement on points 1, 3 & 4 and the hand2hand protection for units behind the CoF just might never happen.

I we say for point No.2 it is per the rules and units cannot be targeted.

Then we can take it to a vote and close it off forever.
Message edited by Banksi - Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 9:26 PM

Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
 
pavlovDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:28 PM | Message # 42
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you already got a free victory because of it...let it go

Boohoo

I'm making a big fold out four tile wide template just for you Hugh.

Alan

Can I ask exactly how you want the Karman players to play the km as we keep putting forward suggestions which keep getting knocked back even the information on the at43 forum seems to have been unpalatable to other non karmen players.

I will not be voting on the new variation on point 2
Message edited by pavlov - Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:35 PM

There is f&*k all cool about 10+ civil engineers running around every battlefield
 
zellakDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:49 PM | Message # 43
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Then we can take it to a vote and close it off forever.

No problem ....though remember votes have to be done face to face...not on this forum. rtfm

I'm making a big fold out four tile wide template just for you Hugh.

Nothing would surprise me. dry

Added (27-Nov-2011, 10:49 PM)
---------------------------------------------
"Can I ask exactly how you want the Karman players to play the KM" wrote Pavlov

Play it as written...but i concede the point that the KM should not be attacked in Close Combat through the CoF.

Message edited by zellak - Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:33 PM

DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "

Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
 
BalrogDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:52 PM | Message # 44
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Quote (Banksi)
OK,

Since we have agreement on points 1, 3 & 4 and the hand2hand protection for units behind the CoF just might never happen.

I we say for point No.2 it is per the rules and units cannot be targeted.

Then we can take it to a vote and close it off forever.

Yeah, I would agree with that.

The CoF rule just doesn't mention close combat in any way, just blocking line of sight through the base of the KM, so we would always have to draw a line from the enemy unit via the KM to the hidden unit, which only needs one model of the unit to be hidden, so u could potentially hide a massive chunk of ur Karman warriors ... a walking shield! That's impressive! BUT, be careful if you use the Shield ability on ur KM, it gets classified as "destroyable terrain elements" (FB Rules - Page 15), which can be "Sabotage!" by field/combat engineers if they work their way round to the front!

It would be a good idea to do a model of some sort for the CoF around the base front , just to show it's active ... eh, Alan friends ... go on, u know u want too! Do it, it's bound to look cool! Here's something I Googled on the web ... Wall of Fire! ... flamy orange Curtain of Flame! cool

Maybe we could meet this Sunday for a bit to get the last of the inHouse Rules sorted? I plan to detail all the items I would like sorted in one thread ... then we can hopfully get back to playing with everyone knowing where they stand with all the inHouse Rule tweaks! biggrin wacko biggrin It's a dream I have! blink wacko blink

Walts "The pain in the ass for rules guy!"
 
BanksiDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 10:54 PM | Message # 45
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Since point No. 2 is a sticking point

Would someone else like to have a stab at suggesting how it might work!!!

Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
 
BalrogDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 11:03 PM | Message # 46
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Hi Banksi ... In regards to close combat, it's not mentioned in the rules, so should have no effect on any hand-2-hand situation, even if the KM is attacked in the rear when the CoF is active. BUT, as another rule tweak, if we say the wall is active around the base, then I would agree that it can't be engaged at the rear in close combat? ... Walts
 
zellakDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 11:07 PM | Message # 47
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Quote (Balrog)
The CoF rule just doesn't mention close combat in any way


True, it does not....... but i am willing to concede this point in order to bring a conclusion to this debate.

DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "

Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
 
BanksiDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 11:23 PM | Message # 48
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Quote (zellak)
True, it does not....... but i am willing to concede this point in order to bring a conclusion to this debate.


Ok Can we have a written line for No.2 please, something short and concise

Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
 
BalrogDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 11:35 PM | Message # 49
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Hi Banksi ... A clarification of the KM - CoF ...

KM Curtain of Fire rules:

If the curtain of fire has been activated:
    1. Any unit that has at least one figure or part of a vehicle behind the Leading Edge(Teknakul Aviation term for front) of the KM wing is protected by the CoF
    2. Enemies cannot engage the KM in Close Combat from the rear.
    3. Curtain of Flame does not do any damage and is a purely defensive item.
    4. As with any vehicle if Shield is used by the KM then those behind the CoF protection can fire as normal.
Nice & Simple ... OK? ... Walts "The pain in the ass for rules guy!"
 
BanksiDate: Sunday, 27-Nov-2011, 11:38 PM | Message # 50
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[color=orange]ok

How about Enemies cannot engage in h2h combat from within the curtain of fire[/color]
Message edited by Banksi - Monday, 28-Nov-2011, 0:53 AM

Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
 
pavlovDate: Monday, 28-Nov-2011, 8:38 PM | Message # 51
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Morning folks

Would the original line not be okay now.

2. Enemies cannot target the units so protected or enter into Hand2hand with any fighter(AT-43 term) through the CoF

Alan

Added (28-Nov-2011, 8:38 PM)
---------------------------------------------
Hi

That's impressive! BUT, be careful if you use the Shield ability on ur KM, it gets classified as "destroyable terrain elements" (FB Rules - Page 15), which can be "Sabotage!" by field/combat engineers if they work their way round to the front!


I would assume you have to be in an area where a fight's going on Walter for that to work biggrin

Alan


There is f&*k all cool about 10+ civil engineers running around every battlefield
 
zellakDate: Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 0:16 AM | Message # 52
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Quote (Balrog)
2. Enemies cannot engage the KM in Close Combat from the rear.


Looks Good to me. happy

DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "

Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
 
BalrogDate: Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 7:31 AM | Message # 53
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Quote (pavlov)
Morning folks

Would the original line not be okay now.

2. Enemies cannot target the units so protected or enter into Hand2hand with any fighter(AT-43 term) through the CoF

Alan

Hi Alan ... ONLY the KM itself gets the Hand-2-Hand bonus ... Walts

Quote (pavlov)
I would assume you have to be in an area where a fight's going on Walter for that to work

Alan

Yeah ... getting round to the front would be a suicide run! ... Walts
 
pavlovDate: Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 5:49 PM | Message # 54
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Hi

ONLY the KM itself gets the Hand-2-Hand bonus

No

Also once the CoF is up you can't pass through it.
Message edited by pavlov - Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 6:10 PM

There is f&*k all cool about 10+ civil engineers running around every battlefield
 
BalrogDate: Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 10:57 PM | Message # 55
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Quote (pavlov)
No

Also once the CoF is up you can't pass through it.

Hi Alan ... I can see that we'll need to disagree on this one and take it to a face-2-face vote.

To be honest, I've changed my mind about conceding the point on any H2H bonus as well. The RULE makes NO mention on ANY H2H bonus. ONLY LoS is effected, however you want to tweak or represent that on the table, so I'm going to stick 100% to what the rule says, for once! There is no wall or template for enemy units to worry about or physically protect the KM or units "within" the curtain. To me, the CoF is a weapon of terror that's fired up to block LoS when needed, that's it.

Walts


. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Grumpy Old Wargamers - Statement Of The Day! . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .


You know, the main problem we're having with the AT-43 rules in general is we're bringing in rules, ideas and concepts from other wargames and forcing them onto the AT-43 game. We're all guilty of this. The AT-43 rules should only be assessed or questioned on their own merit. Obviously, there's always going to be rules that need CLARIFICATION, but reading things into rules that just aren't there, like H2H bonuses with the CoF and my minefield suggestion, is not the way to go, especially when the new rule tweak doesn't benefit ALL the army's. Even if three of the four armys benefit from a rule tweak, we should not use it. It should be all army's that benefit or none and that should be core to all tweaks ... past & present!

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Grumpy Old Wargamers Corner - Statement Of The Day! . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .


That's my moan for the night over .... I had a fight today with a a printer at work, and it won!!! angry2 I hate printers!!!! angry2
 
pavlovDate: Tuesday, 29-Nov-2011, 11:36 PM | Message # 56
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Hi

There is no wall or template for enemy units to worry about or physically protect the KM or units "within" the curtain

Wrong

There is f&*k all cool about 10+ civil engineers running around every battlefield
 
BanksiDate: Wednesday, 30-Nov-2011, 0:50 AM | Message # 57
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ok, hi from luxemburg, beer is rather good, well trying all brands to make sure...

hope we can bring this finally to a conclusion with a vote,

btw might be in on Sunday, might need a rest from alcohol for a change... biggrin

Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
 
zellakDate: Tuesday, 06-Dec-2011, 8:49 PM | Message # 58
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2. Enemies cannot target the units so protected or enter into Hand2hand with any fighter(AT-43 term) through the CoF

The above is a quote from the other thread about this topic.

I thought i would query it here rather than on the other thread.

I do not understand how an enemy unit can attack a Karman unit through the curtain of flame in close combat ?

(as the CoF only extends around the KM base)
wacko

DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "

Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
 
gerrywithaGDate: Sunday, 29-Jan-2012, 11:10 PM | Message # 59
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Hi Gents,

Da'Umpire here

I'm working my way to get a ruling on the issue of Curtain of flames and the King Mammoth

To aid me in this could someone give me an idea of how large the base of the King Mammoth is?

Thanks in advance

Da'Umpire
Message edited by gerrywithaG - Sunday, 29-Jan-2012, 11:11 PM

And I am watching YOU!!!!!!!!!!!
 
zellakDate: Sunday, 29-Jan-2012, 11:32 PM | Message # 60
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Its 130mm diameter. (type 3 AFV base.)

DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "

Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
 
Forum » AT-43 Discussions » AT-43 - Rules, inHouse Rules & FAQs » AT-43 Ability Query (Karman - Curtain of Flames!)
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